Elementalist - Dagger/Dagger

Thanks for cleaning up Hanz :-) Still new to this --Elemelentalist (talk) 11:00, 25 July 2014 (UTC)

Np :P Thanks for contributing! Is Pvp the only part of the game where you play ele btw? Because the PvE but mostly the WvW section needs ele builds and guides too. --Hanz (talk) 11:29, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
Mostly WvW, I'll add some guides there later today--Elemelentalist (talk) 11:38, 25 July 2014 (UTC)

sigil change after might nerf?[edit]

Was just thinking that it'd be better to switch to a sigil of force after the might nerf. Haven't done any calculations but instinctively, after a few rounds of spvp, that seems to provide more damage.

Also, why is hoelbrak listed as the main rune over strength? The 20% condition duration reduction seems subpar compared to the 5% damage.

The patch didn't really change anything tbh. Dmg is a bit lower, that's all. Battle's still a lot better than force, force is only worth it in PvE imo where you can keep doing insane AoE dmg so that 5% modifier is actually better than air/fire - if you are aiming for damage in PvP you need sigil of air and fire. Another thing is, Force does not increase condition damage, and a very high percent of this build's damage is coming from Burning. I'm not really into ele, but I know hoelbrak is more popular. If i had to guess why: 20% condition reduction seems more important than 5% direct-dmg modifier on a spec with no really big crits. The rune helps a lot vs engineers, necs and Poision from doom sigil in general. But I'll keep an eye on tournaments ^^ maybe the might nerf will make eles pick strength runes for increased duration. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 13:24, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

Sigil of Battle[edit]

How can you get the stacks of might if you cannot swap weapons with an Elementalist? Am I missing something blatantly obvious?

Attunement swaps for ele and kit swaps for engi count as weapon swap :) This way every profession can access on-swap sigils. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 08:21, 1 February 2015 (UTC)

Counters[edit]

I suggest to add Necromant altération / altération removal as a counter of elem D/D

It's "conditions" for "altérations" in english

Spell Slinger[edit]

I've tried a variation: move 2 points from Earth into Fire for

Spell Slinger Spell Slinger
Spell Slinger
Cantrips grant you might when used.
Might.png3Might (15s): 90 Power, 90 Condition Damage

which gives an average of 9 stacks of might (24s) every 42 seconds instead of an average of 8 seconds protection every 33 seconds. Basically you go more aggressive instead of defensive. --Warrior Icon Color.png Billaboong (billa-talk) 17:24, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

It's an overkill. If you have trouble reaching 25 might stacks and want to do it at all costs, switch to Strength runes. Having access to protection on 3/4 attunements is a huge thing especially because you can use auras while stunned. And it's possible to get more auras than that by using
Magnetic Leap Magnetic Leap
Magnetic Leap
Pull yourself to your magneticaly grasped foe and deliver a strike.
Damage.pngDamage: 71
Combo.pngCombo Finisher: Leap
Range.pngRange: 900
in a fire field, which is another source of extra might and protection. Cele DD is fine even without 20-25 might stacks btw, so some people take Geomancy and not Battle. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 06:08, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

Rune of the Pack over Strength and Hoelbrak[edit]

First I saw CMC use it and now Kayzi from Risky Business in their match against The Abjured had that rune w/doom & energy. One of the down points of using d/d is lack of damage. The -20% condition duration is hardly noticeable on Hoelbrak IMO and strength runes just help fuel the might stacking cancer. At least I have noticed a much better damage potential from pack as d/d. --Rincewind

Added to variants. Hoelbrak stays main bar'd because it's still the most popular option by far. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 06:35, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Actually..[edit]

.. DD ele's meta status is older than the site, lol - I could live without eles for a year or 2 now--Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 19:16, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

I am pretty sure d/p thief has been meta status for far longer than this site too. Also, what is meta^2? --Goruu (talk) 17:43, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
You're right, but thief being meta is a core part of GW2, like the dodge mechanic (kinda). Shortbow takes it to the next level when it comes to roaming, on the other hand it shouldn't be stacked and it's not completely broken while DD ele is simply the best in slot for nearly everything. Thief is like a ritualist in GW1 - nearly every team had 1 in HA and GvG, but it was't good for the other 7 party slots, while DD ele could basically fill any of the other slots at the same time and that's the problem. Funny thing is, when Anet dropped a balance patch/class overhaul for Dervish while they were busy working on GW2, they did balance changes every day for ~a week, and then frequent adjustments for months if my memory serves me well). Now that GW2 is their main game they don't even release 1 real balance patch per 6 months. They created a really amazing combat system (which is the hard part) and then fail with the small things. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 08:00, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

Not enough DPS[edit]

I'm actually trying this build, mutch more tank than my old one but... SO LOW DAMAGES! Even with 25 stacks of might I cant get half of my previous build's damages... And I dont like being tanky, so could it be possible to add a DPS variant for this build? The preceding unsigned comment was added by Farbas (talk • contribs) .

Nearly half of your damage comes from Burning/conditions/fire attunement so be sure to land Drake's Breath and other fire skills. Lightning Whip is another significant part of your DPS. It has decent damage, maybe it just takes time to get used to the change. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 18:52, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
Well I inflict nothing with drake's breath (1500 damages with 25 might (heavy golem)...), and 3000 with a crit on Fire Grab... So please just tell me where I get my damages/burning stacks...The preceding unsigned comment was added by Farbas (talk • contribs) .
I guess that 1.5k dmg is direct damage. I told you, it's the condition damage that matters. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 07:24, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
I think I get it... Tell me, can Signet of Air replace Armor of Earth? My character is sooo slow... :/
There is nothing stopping you from trying it out. --Goruu (talk) 17:21, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
Basically what Goruu says, however you should be better off with AoE. Attuning to air gives a decent amount of swiftness, attune to air, change attunement, and attune back when it's of CD = perma swiftness. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 17:53, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
Up, Now that this build is nerf... I suggest to add a DPS variant for it. ^^ The preceding unsigned comment was added by Farbas (talk • contribs) .
Or learn the rotation. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 18:31, 7 October 2015 (UTC)

Theme song and nerfs[edit]

As this lovely build will likely be around at least until 2016 and probably beyond how about a theme song? "I have one gear: GO, epic winning" --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 11:26, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

With their 'fantastic' nerf, do we now see more ebola-eles picking earth over fire, or did the patch actually change jack shit? On a less more related note, nice song! --Qiff (talk) 10:03, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
There are certainly more earth users in Q than before (from what I've seen), but they are probably just experimenting, Fire should still be the best I guess - by taking away might on cantrip use bad eles who don't properly stack might will suffer the most (which is good), but if you do your rotations right then it's still easy to get 20-25 stacks especially with a Sigil of Battle and Hoelbrak rune. Blinding Ashes, idk, very minor nerf, didn't change too much if anything. Vigor nerf, lol, from other traits it still has ~perma vigor without changing anything. Then finally there is Ring of Fire which imo was actually buffed - before the patch it had some counterplay (simply don't cross the circle, or just doge through), now you get hit by 2 stacks of Burn the moment it's placed which also means it can be used for downed cleaving now. This needs sustain nerf which simply didn't happen, but as a start I'd nerf ring of fire CD which would gut their might uptime too. People overrect to the nerfs because they want to think that it's gone, after the patch our team had 3 eles enemy team had 0, they lol'd and said we missed the patch notes, we ended up winning with 500-150 so yeah.--Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 13:39, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
Are you going to drop the "meta squared" nonsense yet? It came across as whiny when you first made the change, but now that they've adjusted the spec a bit, are you going to let it go? Perhaps you'll keep it up until the devs nerf it to your satisfaction? It really feels like an abuse of power in your position, to influence player opinions and pressure the developers. Especially considering the gem, "I could live without eles for a year or 2 now." Smells like an agenda. No, I don't play D/D Ele. --Terriblebuilddude (talk) 23:35, 3 October 2015 (UTC)
FYI I didn't do the meta^2 thing. Btw I do play DD ele and there's a solid chance that I'll be playing this with leagues (me and maybe some other teammates too, like other 2-3) :P A real nerf would benefit the health of the game though. Maybe we'll let it go, but the playerbase won't because it's completely broken. Anet proposed some really good nerf ideas before the spec patch but they decided not to implement them, maybe they listened to all the ele QQ on the forum, idk. Profession forum = worst source of information, Anet should know it by now. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 06:30, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Do you recognize that your crusade to influence opinion and kill the class in sPvP is having consequences in every game mode? A very recent example of the consequence of Ele nerfs is that -none- of the groups that have cleared the raid thus far have used an Elementalist. Let's talk in 6 months, when Ele is no longer considered meta in 2/3 game modes, so you can gloat about how great it is to have the Ele menace gone. Nearly every class is experiencing power creep with the elite specializations, but with Tempest DoA and the base class getting nerfed every patch, 2016 will be terrible for the class. Furthermore, people continue to whine about "QQ Ele OP," even as they run the incredibly broken Chronomancer, Scrapper, and Reaper. But hey, as long as people -think- that the class is overpowered, the devs will react with nerfs, and the haters win. After all, you made it clear that you'd be perfectly happy with Eles absent for a year or two. Should someone with such an agenda really be an admin on such an influential site?--Terriblebuilddude (talk) 18:14, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
Let me get this straight. We obviously have our own opinions of classes here and yes I wish some builds would die in a hole, but that never truly affects how we treat builds. Let's look at shoutbow - a build I hate way more than ele or Kim Jong Un, I've recently tagged it as meta instead of burying it which arguably made it a lot more popular in queues but it had to be done because of its popularity on EU tournaments. Some facts: the latest WTS was won by a double ele comp, a 4 ele comp won a weekly cup which made ESl ban the comp, and ques are still swarming with eles (not so much on beta weekends, for obvious reasons). Meta^2, while there's joking and even a bit of salt involved, is a true and relevant thing in GW2, as the "meta" is basically a collection of the most common builds, but ele is by faaaar the most common one. We wouldn't do something like this if it wasn't absolutely true and relevant - the purpose of the site is to mirror what's going on in the game, and this is exactly what's going on. While we can influence the in-game situation, in general it's the other way around. It wasn't intended to stay up there forever, it'll probably be removed this week especially if people are so salty about it. Btw you really think that anet nerfed ice bow in PvE because we had a completely unrealted build in a meta^2 field in PvP, and not because it was dominating that part of the game so hard for years that essentially every single build across all professions is rated based on how well it can interact with that conjure weapon? World 1st vale guardian kill had no ele, so what? It's A) only 1 kill B) that comp's probably not refined at all C) most of the elite specs used there will likely be nerfed. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 18:43, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
Alright, I'll take that. Thanks for clearing things up in a reasonable manner without insulting me or shutting me down.--Terriblebuilddude (talk) 18:47, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
Hmm, that went well ^^ --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 18:49, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
still ele hate? wow, nobody even complain anymore on the forums now that only vets are playing ele..still some people complain, don't take me wrong I do despise classes like necro with all the condi spam, but my "hatred" does not extend to the players behind it and certainly I don't go around saying "I'd be good with no necros for the next 2 years"...wow, just wow ----EleFanboy(talk)
lol the official forum is a joke, everyone knows that.. ele is still broken, but now you actually have to do the rotation to stack might which made some people quit playing it instead of watching 1-2 mins of a video made by Phantaram to learn it, that's all. Btw I don't blame the people for using what's effective, that's normal human behavior, idk where you got that from, I just find it sad that this build exists in its current form, and it's been around since 2014. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 08:09, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
HA MMOs...you're either hated for outsustaining your opponent or outbursting him...this argument is rather amusing and this is why. You'd be happy to have a game with no eles, like nerfing it to a point where it'd be pointless to keep it in game, ok delete ele, then the hate crusade would move to the next "best" thing after ele, something that is used 2x in ESL team. You see, I don't think any of people commenting on balance would be able to create a game where 9 professions share the same 50/50 win/lose ratio at any given skill level ( noob, average, veteran ), that would be mathematically impossible given the number of variables. Inevitably some professions will gain an "unfair" advantage in some match up and those professions will be "abused" in tournaments, removing the first will simply move the focus to the second one, you will never get rid of unfair match up for as long as there are that many professions, if not double ele...it'll be double engi...double war, double necro and so on, we already seen it didn't we?. Now I just wonder if you administrators will keep consistency when it'll be your profession to be abused in tournaments, can we expect the same level of comments ( team 4 ele balanced etc )? ----EleFanboy(talk)
As someone who quit playing nec 1 hour after Dhuumfire was added to the game in 2013 and make nec disgustingly OP for a short while I think I can stay objective :D Don't delete the profession, but celestial DD needs a massive overhaul. If you think I'm wrong, could you mention 1 single downside for having a DD ele in any conquest role? It has god tier mobility, can disengage well and reset itself in less than 10 seconds, can beat basically anything in 1v1, great at teamfights, great at condi cleansing, can support allies by healing/cleansing/boon sharing (both offensive and defensive, or even "utility" boons like Swiftness), has both power and condi pressure (it can even do burst dmg) not to mention both soft- and hard-CC, etc. This build is basically perfect - well maybe you could add a smoke field for stealth but that's pretty much it. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 14:27, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
Why keep mentioning the team support abilities of the ele? I understand that this it's done to blow everything out of proportions but we all know that players, nobody really ever cared about the team support abilities of a profession, you could remove all team support options of the ele and people would still complain regardless, it's not like bunker guardian has ever been deemed OP and why is that? ha yes you can't die to bunker guardian therefore..it's balanced even though it's not really. The real problem for people is that ele wins fight by outsustain the enemy and that's all ele really have, without the sustain the real problems of the ele would surface : subpar damage, CC and build variety; it'd be the equivalent of removing stealth from thieves. yes massive overhaul is what ele needs and that would include a vast number of buffs to the core profession, I mean in a perfect world with no d/d, no cantrips and no water/arcana sustain...who would even play an ele?..you?. If you want to simply nerf sustain of ele without any compensation..well they done that already in the past and what did happen? ele was gone from everywhere except zerg staff ele in wvw ( and even there was rare to see one ), this was in 2013, the core problems of the class were so obvious that the devs were forced to unnerf the ele.----EleFanboy(talk)
lol team support potential IS important and it's one of the reasons why it can be stacked so well on teams, but yes people would still complain because of the other 47238764234 things it's good at. In its current implementation, it's either super OP or super trash, that's why it needs an overhaul. Bunker guard is balanced because let's say it's 10/10 at team support and point holding but it's really bad at dmg and mobility. In order for DD ele to be balanced it should be a 5/10 or 6/10 at everything, but instead it's probably a ~8/10 or better at everything and that's the problem. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 16:15, 11 October 2015 (UTC)

We're not dropping meta^2 just yet. Two more weeks of watching esl tournies will decide what is happening (So even if ele has dropped out of meta^2 we don't usually reflect it immediately, please be patient). If, on the other hand, you believe we're proactively influencing the meta, please educate yourself on the state of the game. This change was done months (years?) after it was truly a notch above meta. You do not see other classes doubling up in comps with nearly the same effectiveness. It is toxic to the game. If it causes ANet to balance it, that would be a good thing for the game. Any future conversation assuming it was a "whiny" move should be in civil tones or at the risk of a temp ban. « Chase ♥ ♥ ♥ » 21:00, 5 October 2015 (UTC

Tempest?[edit]

I've found that replacing Water or Earth with the Tempest trait line is also extremely viable. Thinking about throwing a variant in rather than creating an entirely new page with the same basic principles. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngKalif 2:01, 6 November 2015 (UTC)

http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Tempest_-_Dagger/Dagger --Necromancer Icon Color.pngKalif 2:17, 6 November 2015 (UTC)
Well, there's already a cele D/x build both for tempest and Ele, not sure if there's a point at making a 3rd one that fuses the 2. Cele DD relies heavily on the might stacking rotation anyways which you'd mess up by using any overloads but air, plus Arcana and Tempest don't mix well I guess. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 13:15, 6 November 2015 (UTC)