Welcome to MetaBattle[edit]

Hey Valento!

First Steps:

  • Be sure to check out the tutorial. Submitting the first edit/create with any external links results in an automatic ban. Instructions are in the tutorial under "creating an article").
  • Sign your comments on Discussion pages with 4 tildes ("~~~~") or use the "signature" button found on the toolbar. It will automatically convert this into a timestamp with your name. (You can indent paragraphs/replies with the ":" colon character).
  • If you have any questions feel free to respond here or add a new topic on the community portal.
  • All users are encouraged to submit valid ratings for builds in testing, good, great, and meta.

Common Mistakes:

  • Try to make a build that has purpose. Explain it's specific purpose and why it's better than other builds. If it's not, re-consider whether it should be written.
  • Make sure the build you want to write is significantly different than other builds already posted. Otherwise leave a comment with the proposed changes on the already existing build's page!

Thanks for joining and welcome to the MetaBattle team!

Bot Acct[edit]

Hey, Valento -- Good changes still! No need to apologize for the edits, they're pretty good over all. I'd request for you to create an alt account, which I'll give "bot" and admin permissions to. This should allow you to make many edits without cluttering the recent changes section. Of course the side effect is that your messages will not appear in community portal (user talk pages will still get notifications). You might be able to give yourself the correct privileges too, I'm not sure which power Galaxian bestowed :P « Chase ♥ ♥ ♥ » 16:29, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Oh, dem! I somehow missed your message, sorry for the late reply. So, while I understand a bit about editing, I don't know how one goes about bot edits (Ishmael does this in official wiki, but I know nothing about it). If someone can handle this it would be appreciated. >.< Valento (talk) 13:24, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Create a new account with whatever name you like (ValentoBot works) and then I'll give it proper permissions. Don't want to make a password and then have you change it yourself later haha « Chase ♥ ♥ ♥ » 13:27, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
I understand this part, but I don't know how to make it work. xD Valento (talk) 13:34, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
In any case, here you go. My bot acc. LordShuckle (talk) 13:43, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Edits by LordShuckle will no longer show up in recent changes unless someone opts to show bot edits. « Chase ♥ ♥ ♥ » 17:40, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

You really need to start logging into LordShuckle when doing your mass edits/uploads etc. « Chase ♥ ♥ ♥ » 16:08, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Dang... I was sure I was missing something. In the official wiki they use bots to do automated edits, I didn't know I could simply log in and do my stuff (I don't know about automated botting btw). Valento (talk) 20:06, 28 November 2015 (UTC)


It's indeed a tricky one :D Everyone messes it up on the 1st encounter. I thought it was "Chill" too for more than 5 years xD --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 13:47, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

Yeah!! And right now my head is a bit busy with all these mechanics icons, so I missed that one... and I thought it was because I'm not a native English speaker. xD Valento (talk) 13:48, 17 November 2015 (UTC)


First of all, wow gj! Amazing job :P However the mesmer Inspiration line seems to be broken. --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 19:37, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Gah! I'll look into that. LordShuckle (talk) 19:41, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
For some reason I just didn't create them lol... will do now. LordShuckle (talk) 19:46, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
Weirdly enough if I prefix the template call with ::: indent, it simply breaks my HTML. >_>

Done. If you find any other missing specs please let me know. I think I got confused due to the amount of traits I went through. Valento (talk) 20:12, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
Ty, that's understandable tho ^^ Another question, how can I link individual traits? --Necromancer Icon Color.pngHanz(talk) 20:28, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
Try {{Trait tooltip}}. Valento (talk) 20:30, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Herald table not working?[edit]

Chosen major and grandmaster traits don't seem to be highlighted for herald.

Zyke (talk) 01:42, 5 December 2015 (UTC)

Indeed, something's off. I'll look into that. Thank you. Valento (talk) 10:42, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
It should be working now. Sorry about that! Valento (talk) 11:00, 5 December 2015 (UTC)
Uh, now Enhanced Bulwark uses the hexagonal minor icon shape instead of the square. Zyke (talk) 02:51, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
I think that's from the dat file. Not sure if they've updated it to match the standard (square). Valento (talk) 10:51, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

Chrono Utility Dps[edit]

Chronomancer Utility DPS is a very confusing name since it doesn't do dps via utilities. It either supports the group with shield phantasms, wells and time warp or does support with wells, time warp and dps with sword phantasms. Thus I would suggest using one of the other build names that have been discussed on the discussion page. Fredor (talk) 09:41, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

I moved sort of prematurely because there's a somewhat long discussion, so I thought it would be more accurate than the previous name until you guys stablish a solid consensus. --Valento (talk) 11:23, 15 December 2015 (UTC)


I have trouble getting the skillbar template to work. Are these codes already useable or are there still skills missing? Fredor (talk) 10:27, 17 December 2015 (UTC)

It's not usable until we have all skills appropriately documented with {{Skill info}}. This is so because the template makes a database-like query based on input, and without semantic data it won't return anything. At first sight it might look daunting, but filling up skill entries is very simple because I copied almost all of the parameters that official wiki uses. This means that creating a skill page is as simple as copying a certain skill data from official wiki and pasting it here, with a few adjustments. What you will need to copy is the Skill infobox template part, only things that are different:
  • variables parameter is named facts (official wiki just got used to this weird name and didn't bother renaming it)
  • We don't need channel-type, hero points, and a few other simply because we don't need it in tooltips or skillbar relationships (i.e. they can be culled)
  • The template name here is Skill info, not Skill infobox.
  • If a skill has more than ONE skill fact, all of the skill fact calls need an index parameter because I use them to sort the list of skill facts.
That's it. Might look like a lot to go through, but it's not really. If you don't feel confident enough, I will fill up these entries with time. Hanz is also lending me a huge help with Revenant. The more people the better! --Valento (talk) 10:51, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
Okay i'll look into when I have some spare time and builds don't need to be updated ;) Fredor (talk) 11:21, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
That's right! Builds should be your top priority. :) Valento (talk) 11:36, 17 December 2015 (UTC)

SMW Front Page[edit]

I have some ideas. Let me know if any of these are possible with SMW:

  • build's weaponset
  • possible key elements (Damage, Control, Support, High Mobility, Team Fighter, etc.)
  • number of views in graph format
  • number of ratings submitted
  • last edited
  • tagging / wrapping multiple key elements in the same div for styling purposes
  • removing any text if smw returns null (aka "quiet" when nothing found)

Can we create teams with SMW? Team name, wins, losses, history, compositions (99% ele, 75% engi, 25% ranger, 100% mesmer, etc). How would this work for non-technical users? I want streamers/match shoutcasters to be able to use our site to keep track of what's going on in tournaments. And it has to be dead simple, beyond simple if possible.

Lastly, if we implemented a "guide" section, I'd like it to be the last 5 guides that were updated. We don't actually hav ea lot of guide writers, but if we show the temporary ones then we can start doing seasonal guides etc. This is kind of like a "blog" system akin to what dulfy does on her site. This was already possible with our previous extension, I'm assuming it's also okay in SMW but just checking to make sure. ChaseBot (talk) 18:01, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

Hmm... hmmm. K, let's see:
  • Build's weaponset: We have {{Skillbar}} that, when main = y, displays a lot of stuff (including heads-up mechanics UI). I can implement a property to set the current weapons as part of the build in a possible "Has weaponset". This property can be multi-valued and will contain "set1weapon1/set1weapon2, set2weapon1/set2weapon2". What do you think? Eg. "Sword/Sword,Greatsword". Not sure how else I could store these. Having this way I can #explode the weapons (split them).
  • These elements already exist in {{MBuild}}, it's param focus. I can add more options.
  • Number of views and number of ratings isn't something I can actually store because it's not possible to detect AFAIK. I can look into it but if anything Galaxian would have to add a hook (check his talkpage) that provides these statistics for a given pagename.
  • Last edited... I think this is possible. Will have to look into it.
  • Yes. Tagging is a very broad term, tag is split into several levels (ex: rating, focus, profession, game type [dungeon, raid, pvp, etc]). Too broad. If you architecture the layout and provide what parameters you need (besides what is available at {{MBuild}}) I can SMW-fy it.
  • Sure! I'm becoming pro at null returns hahah.
We can create anything. SMW allows you to create a database. Literally. We only need a "primary key" (non-repeatable unique identifier) which is 99% of the time the PAGENAME. We can create a team with name, wins, losses, history, composition... with SMW and #arraymap, multi-valued data structures isn't an obstacle. At all. Limiting access is what makes thing difficult. The solution for this for wikis is creating a different NAMESPACE, and a group, and allows only members of such group to edit such namespace. It's a way to stablish protected relationships across the wiki. Simplicity is easy, I can wrap up the hell out of it into a template and only ask for parameters. :)
Guide section. I think this deserves a separate namespace, but I might be overdoing it... not sure. Oh well, I like namespaces because they're a way to avoid disambiguation titles (think "My Deadly Touch (skill)" and "My Deadly Touch (trait)", these things between parentheses). Anyways, totally possible. :) --Valento (talk) 18:44, 18 December 2015 (UTC)
Please reset to no-indent after this, there's a lot to read haha.
* As long as I can wrap the two different weaponsets, or perhaps feed them into the PvP-Weapons template that we have so we can display them on the main page in a smaller way.
* I remember reading something along the lines on Galaxian's Talk page. I'll look into it further later. As long as it's "somewhat possible" I'm happy.
* Tagging is confusing me. But I think I understand what you're saying. Basically I have to know which things I want to split up/group and then you can fix it from there? My idea was that we have existing elements like "meta" and we have "elementalist" and from there I can remove the "Elementalist" from the title with jquery (explode by "-") and then convert that into an icon while pulling the meta from smw and making that into an icon too. This way we can list Elementalist builds alphabetically and still keep the information. But that may not be a good idea anyways, so no worries.
* Okay this is super awesome then. Ideally i want to be able to build a "scoreboard" using the database so that if they nput this team beat that team, then it will automatically update the front page bracket. Different namespace is smart idea. I'll think about this further, but will move it away for a bit. Glad to know it's somewhat possible. Sounds exciting :D
* Guide should already be a namespace. We have some in there already I think.
Really good info, my mind is swimming with possibilities! ChaseBot (talk) 19:16, 18 December 2015 (UTC)
You guys use the word "tag", and I understand this as property. "Great", "Good", and "Basic" are all possible values for a rating, therefore rating is a property, or... tag. Some builds are "meta", therefore "being meta" is a property I named "Is meta build", which can have the values true or false for obvious reasons. All of these are properties, information about a single build. A build can also have many focuses so it would be a shame to only be dps when it can also be utility. To achieve multi-valued properties I set all values a want to the same properties and SMW arrange them in an array, for each build. That's why the property "Has build focus" can be "Direct damage, Utility, Condition damage". It's a multi-valued property, or a multi-valued "tag". It's all about information, and they're laid out very close like a real database. Things become more complex when a build has a rating parameter, but depending on the value I set a different property. Regarding rating, when it's Great, Good, or Basic I set "Has build rating" property, but when it's draft I set "Is draft build" to true, and when it's archived I set "Is archived build" to true. I understand that, although semantically different, all of these varying values are all EXCLUSIVE. A build can't be Great and Archived, it can't be Draft and Meta either. So rating defines more than the rating, but also the "state". I made a shady optimization here as soon as I realized how you laid out "tags". hehe
I recommend you read this properties page. It's a documentation. It shows each template-related properties, their allowed values, their usage, everything. As you read you start to understand that properties are, after all, different information about a build, in a sweet semantic way. The more semantic, the more useful it becomes in practice to the community, because humans seek relationships and the most appropriate builds for their situations. --Valento (talk) 19:36, 18 December 2015 (UTC)
  • I've added support for {{Skillbar}} to annotate weaponset for a page if the prop parameter is set.
  • MediaWiki had a {{NUMBEROFVIEWS}} magic word but it got dropped in favor of caching (faster loading), so it's not possible.
  • I've added a new Was last modified in property that does what you expect.
  • {{SMW build pull}} now displays nothing if the query has no results.
Now, about Teams. We have a Team namespace but I'm not sure how we can separate team builds from teams themselves (in case of tracking tourney info). IMO the simplest solution, although somewhat not too pretty is to create team build pages under Build namespace and use Team for another purpose.
Guides are simpler, we only need to specify properties and such. I'd like you to give me what parameters you want, and also give me what sort of "notice box" you want to display with a few test cases, from there on I can work on that notice box and SMW-fy it. Actually everything revolves around these two things: a notice box, and a list of parameters, from there on I just work on the css elements and come up with a final template. Tell me how you want to do things so we can start with Teams and Guides. --Valento (talk) 12:44, 19 December 2015 (UTC)


Dungeon builds are done, however they won't show up in the profession-filtered section of the front page (so Staff Ele shows up in dungeons, but not in Elementalist builds). I guess you didn't adjust them yet so it's k, however Guardian builds do show up for whatever reason :D Also, team builds don't show up at all not even in Dungeons, so I reverted those changes for now. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 19:24, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

Yo! I found da reson, it's because Team isn't generating SMW annotations (it's not SMW-fied). I'll send Galaxian a word! :D Valento (talk) 19:43, 18 December 2015 (UTC)
Try changing swapping templates for teams now please, it should work. --Valento (talk) 11:20, 19 December 2015 (UTC)

Team builds unlike the normal build pages still show up in both Meta and Great/Good. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 11:47, 19 December 2015 (UTC)

Fixed. --Valento (talk) 12:18, 19 December 2015 (UTC)